bring diesels to the US
Please start brining the efficient diesels to the US market. It would be nice to reap the benefits of high mpg while driving on diesel (dare I say biodiesel) made right here in this country. It sounds like a win-win situation: 1. Lower fuel costs with higher miles per gallon 2. Decreasing our dependence on foreign oil I had the fortunate opportunity to drive a Ford C-MAX diesel while in France this past year and it was a phenomenal vehicle. It changed the way I felt about Fords in general.
By: Adam M.
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3 COMMENTS ON THIS IDEA
Andrew K if vw can figure this out - i don't understand why ford can't. comeonnn - bring the diesel and manual to (practically)every trim level like you do in the UK/europe!
1 year(s) ago via
Clayton P While I promote diesel engines in the US, I must say I understand where the automakers are coming from (although I think it is foolish). They are saying due to the regulations on emissions it would cost more to develop the engines to put into sedans and small SUVs/CUVs. I do believe however that the overall cost of development would be countered by the profits they would receive from the large number of Americans who would willingly purchase a diesel powered vehicle, and therefore the price of a gallon of diesel fuel would drop because the demand would be raised.
1 year(s) ago via
Matt M Please put a diesel in the fiesta and focus for the US market. We would love it!!! Also put a 4L diesel in the F150 to really capture the market!
2 year(s) ago via
Kevin Biglin The Brits just crossed the antartic in two diesel powered Econoline's. Note, they were the 7.3 L. The last of the dependable PSD's Does Ford even offer an Econoline with the PSD now?
3 year(s) ago via
chris schaefer I think Ford (and others) are missing a real marketing opportunity by not making available small diesel trucks and CUV's. They could easily be marketed as having better fuel economy and better towing capacity. There is a real need for a smaller utility (can fit in your garage) that can tow a trailer (boat, camper, snow machine etc.). I have seen the specs on the diesel subaru forrester that is sold in Europe. That thing would sell very well here with an automatic transmission and the right marketing approach. It's mid size, seats five, gets great economy and can tow a trailer. Why not a diesel Escape/Kuga here in N. America?
3 year(s) ago via
Tom T Yep, I'm waiting for that Ford Ranger diesel as well. I currently drive a 97 Ranger 4WD.
3 year(s) ago via
BWBasham We also rented a C-Max diesel a few years ago in Spain. It was a GREAT car that we would have bought here in the states if available. Can't wait for them to get here. Diesel works very well...we need it here.
4 year(s) ago via
Sean Hayes I would love to have a diesel ranger with a crew cab please. I just don't understand why you wouldn't bring small diesels here to the us, when they get better fuel economy and make enough power to keep Americans happy. So I wouldn't have to sacrifice performance for fuel economy. An f150 with the 4.4L TDI V8 you already designed an tested would be a big seller. I also don't believe that the global ranger would cannibalize f150 sales here in the states. I believe it would bring in more customers who perhaps went with toyota, chevy, dodge, or nissan because the ranger wasn't big enough for a family and the f150 was more than what people wanted. Wouldn't it be best if you beat everyone else to market with small diesels for both cars and trucks both big and small. Please think about what you can gain with both diesels and the global ranger here in the states.
4 year(s) ago via
David Mellor US grown Algae based biodiesel is coming and coming fast and will solve the foreign oil based fossil fuel dependence issue. We can do it with rapeseed/canola just like Europe does until then.
4 year(s) ago via
Don Agreed with many above. Diesels need to be in most of the Ford lineup. They have the best distrubtion network to rollout a large diverse base of diesel vehicles. They could sell diesels in anything from eco cars like Fiesta, to midsize cars like Fusion, full size cars like Taurus, small trucks like Ranger, full size trucks like F-150, etc. VW is selling the heck out of the TDI jetta and thats the only platform they are selling it on and they don't have much else to sell it on in the US if they wanted it to. Imagine the possibilities.
4 year(s) ago via
Elmer S Back in '86 Ford had a diesel Range that I just loved. Wish that I still had access to it. It was a 2.3L Turbo 4 that just was plain fun to drive. Ford needs to bring small diesels back to the market for those of us who really don't want or need a 250 class or larger truck. Forget about CA and their requirements and deal with the rest of the states.
4 year(s) ago via
Eric R Thanks Cole. Now run up to that corner office and bang on Alan's door and show him these posts!! Just kidding, of course. Very much hoping we do get the little diesels.. And glad you guys finally got a CEO that isn't a finance guy. Got alot of respect for him.
4 year(s) ago via
BILL B VW didnt make a 2008 TDI. There was 2006 then they came back in 2009 and now 2010.
4 year(s) ago via
Bill B I wish GM didnt cancel thier 1/2 ton truck diesel program. So since gm isnt really in the place to start making them i would switch to ford if they would just come out with a f150 diesel that got 25 miles to a gallon. also maybe if ford had the balls to come out with a diesel car i wouldnt of had to buy a foreign volkswagen jetta TDI. I you asked me what i trusted more Hybrid vs diesel i would choose a diesel anyday. I love to buy americian but i cant do that if americian automakers dont make what i want. by the way 50 MPG on my TDI is AWSOME.
4 year(s) ago via
cole Yes, someone is reading these comments. Cole Quinnell Editorial Director theFordStory.com
4 year(s) ago via
Eric R To Ford: Is anyone in your company reading these comments? Clearly there is strong demand for small diesels. Please respond! I hope all this typing is not just us customers chatting (dreaming) amongst ourselves.
4 year(s) ago via
Paul Y If Ford brings high-quality, high-mileage diesels as an option to US buyers, they will buy them. I had a 2000 VW Jetta that got about 45 mpg average. I loved the car and people asked me about it everywhere I went. I filled up with fuel every two weeks! I would love to be able to buy a Ford, Mercury or Lincoln with a diesel.
4 year(s) ago via
scott Seigmund Dean, I've been with ford long enough to have owned the small displacement turbo charged cars from the 1980's. While I had good service from those cars, they were mostly considered a nightmare for reliability and maintenance. I'm sure the new Ecoboost power plants will be better, but there is no free lunch. The Taurus SHO, for example, has two turbo chargers and wants premium fuel for optimal performance, and the car carries a mid-$40 price tag which helps hide the cost of the power plant. The 2.3 turbo powered Fords from the 1980s could not tow anything because this would cause sustained high boost that could cause engine failure. The new Ecoboost power plants utilize high-strenght/high-cost materials to overcome these issues. Combined with high pressure direct injection, just like modern diesels, I cannot see how will be much cheaper to manufacture. In are recent test between the Taurus SHO and the Chrysler 300C AWD equipped with the low tech, rock reliable 5.7 HEMI, the Ecoboost Taurus returned 21.8 mpg versus 20.7 for the 300C HEMI. This is a 5.5 percent advantage in fuel economy using premium fuel that cost at least 8 percent. Is this progress?????
4 year(s) ago via
H Smith WHY? E85 would provide roughly 1/3 the mpg of a reasonable small displacement diesel (that could run on "green" bio diesel BTW). Diesel could easily save the average E85 driver about 600 gallons/15K miles (per year?)!!! Please explain your reasoning ....
4 year(s) ago via
James Wagner I live in Green Bay, WI My Jetta Diesel starts everytime in the winter. Yes it does get cold here. My point is that the new Diesels can be made and work well. Just wish there was a American car maker with a small one in a small truck or car. Look back at Fords 198X Escort/Lynx/Ranger those diesels were getting 45MPG back then!
4 year(s) ago via
James Wagner I know Ford has Ranger Diesels around the world. Why not here? I would love a Diesel engine based off what is already there in the Mazda 2.3L 4 valve 4cyl engine. That engine converted to Diesel would be great in a Ranger with a turbo on it. I think the Ranger is in need of this, the full size Super Duty lineup has a diesel option. Why not the Ranger line? I would ditch my old faithful Ford truck for a Ranger diesel stick anyday. For those who doubt a diesel being refined over the years go to your area WV dealer and try a VW Jetta.
4 year(s) ago via
richard kennedy I would much rather buy a crew cab 4x4 Ranger w/a small diesel than a Mahindra. Come on Ford give us what we want n need.
4 year(s) ago via
Hector Darren what do you know about diesels? Honda's are better made? Their not why? Because a Diesel maintained very well with the proper maintenance can last at least 400,00. Can a Honda Gasser do that?
4 year(s) ago via
Jim I would buy another Ranger if I could get one with a Diesel engine! Since that is not going to happen in the very near future, I guess I'll buy a Mahindra TR-series truck.
4 year(s) ago via
Kevin Bob, have you ever driven a diesel car or truck? Lot's of torque is lots of fun. Not many places with E85 around.
4 year(s) ago via
Adrenaline Dial Sorry to bust your bubble, but a modern diesel is a very very complicated engine. The first biggest complication comes from the fact that virtually all modern diesels (including the TDCi engines from european cars) use common-rail high pressure injection systems that are difficult to troubleshoot without the proper "dealership" equipment. The injectors are piezo-electrical, fully electronically actuated. Each injector comes with a unique 16-digit code indicating specific performance characteristics measured at the factory. The code needs to be programmed in the car's ECU or it will not work properly. In an "old" diesel, fuel injection pressures are around 150 bar. In a common-rail diesel, rail pressure reaches 1600 bar. The second source of complications is the turbocharger. It spins at more than 100.000 RPM so the tolerances are tight and repairing it requires special tools and skills. A modern diesel engine is equal in complexity to an ECO-boost engine (direct injection, turbocharger, etc), but the parts in a diesel are exposed to a lot more mechanical stress. For example, the fuel injection in a direct-injected petrol engine runs at about 100 bar, versus 1600 bar in a diesel.
4 year(s) ago via
Bob I think going with more diesel is a bad idea. Let's lesson our reliance on oil and go with E85 and plug-in hybrid vehicles. Battery technology is advancing far faster than the efficiency of diesels ever will.
4 year(s) ago via
jflarin What we need is a small 4x4 pickup with diesel engine consuming 6l/100km. Something that can tow about 2500lbs. With crew cab. That would be the most polyvalent vehicule. Right now, you can by a Toyota Venza AWD at 36k$. you can tow 2500lbs, you can put 2 adult and 2 children, but you don't have the pickup bed. You can buy a Volkswagen TDI: you have the low fuel consumption, you can seat 4, but no 4x4 and no pickup bed. You can buy a ranger with the 2.3l, but then you can't tow much, you can't seat 4 and you don't have the 4x4. The F150 with 4x4 and crew cab drinks too much gas...
4 year(s) ago via
Andy I have been to Europe and their small diesels are outstanding. I have owned full sized trucks but don't need that large any more. What I do need is a small truck for occasional hauling and great fuel economy for commuting. A Ranger with a 4 or 5 cyl diesel is what I am waiting for.
4 year(s) ago via
Terry Years ago, there was an in-line 4 Ranger diesel (maybe the same engine as the Taurus had?). For customers who want an economical small truck, driving long, straight routes what could be better? I've had VW diesels since the early 1990's. At one time during an economic downturn when pay was short and bills were high, I was able to make a few cents per kilometre on my mileage claims. They may be short on kick-down power, they make up for it with highway efficiency.
4 year(s) ago via
Brad Aside from Volkswagen, there aren't any affordable diesels on the US market. Honda backed out with their diesel Accord, GM seems like they have given up. VW sells every single one of their diesel Jettas, Golfs and so on, and often at a great price over the MSRP. Why not do the same for the Fiesta, Focus or Fusion? Better yet, keep the prices down, and you can totally undercut the competition. But if there is one thing that you can get wrong, its not offering a manual transmission with them. Please, at the very least, let us row our own gears.
4 year(s) ago via
Jason I would also like to see more diesel cars on the market here for just about the entire Ford range. From small cars, to trucks, and to Lincolns even. Also, a diesel hybrid car would be the best of both worlds; great city mpg and great highway mpg.
4 year(s) ago via
Wayne Fuel-efficient diesel engines that can use B80 or even B100 biodiesel.
4 year(s) ago via
Ray Small Diesel in the F150/Expedition - PELASE! - Lay off the Ecoboost = diesel ..... fumes. Not eveyone is that stupid .... The excuse was Diesel will not sell! ... who is doing your marketing reserach ? ... They need to look at VW's diesel sale numbers.
4 year(s) ago via
brent PLEASE!!! Turbo diesels are the future and who doesn't want that kind of power with great fuel economy. This is why i own my Audi.
4 year(s) ago via
Leo O Diesel is still made from petroleum, just like gasoline. The issue isn't how much fuel you burn, it's WHAT fuel, and whom it enriches. I'd rather my fuel money go to farmers in the Midwest rather than regimes in the Mideast. And if a fuel is renewable, clean-burning, can't have its market controlled and price spiked by a foreign cartel, and doesn't fund extremism, who cares if you have to fill up 3 times a month instead of twice? That's why instead of diesel we should be asking Ford to promote REAL alternative fuels like ethanol and methanol for regular cars, and biodiesel and dimethyl ether for heavy duty large trucks and vans.
4 year(s) ago via
whiskey_Jack Agreed. A diesel small pickup would win me over just fine
4 year(s) ago via
Crikey McGregor YES! I drove a diesel (albeit VW) with manual transmission Frankfurt to Lyon round trip. The road-toll on the French highway cost me more than the fuel ..... and at one point I worried the fuel gauge might in fact not be working.
4 year(s) ago via
Jaroslav How come small and efficient diesels are not here yet??? Marketing, engineering, are you sleeping???
4 year(s) ago via
Loren Scott I was in Belize a few years ago and saw an amazing sight... A quad cab, Turbo Diesel Ford Ranger... She was a sight to behold, covered in mud with big knobby all terrain tires.
4 year(s) ago via
Caleb Yes!!!! F150, Fusion, Taurus Diesels!!! Don't make me buy a VW!
4 year(s) ago via
Darren M Hi Ross, I do stand corrected on the 2.0TDI -- it needs no AdBlue, you're right. And, it's true, as you say, that "you can't even smell the exhaust from a new audi/vw diesel" but alas the key word here is "new". A couple years into their life, once the trick, high-pressure injectors get a sheen on them and tolerances loosen up, even the clean diesels start to smell and soot. Case in point: my neighbour's 2008 Jetta TDI wagon, a mere 55k kms on it, trails black smoke and, well, stinks. Certainly not as much as diesels of old, not by a long shot, but it definitely smells distinctly. And don't get me started about his winter cold starts - blech! As for small diesels being simple and affordable, I'm afraid I'll have to call you on that. There's a lot of technology making them "clean" -- high-pressure fuel pumps, common rail lines and ultra fine spray injectors - and all of it is expensive. This is both the diesel premium when you buy and the brutal replacements costs if it fails down the road. VW quality being what it is, i.e spotty at best, I still maintain - and this is really my point in this thread - that the economics of diesels just don't make sense in N. America despite the high mileage. (Disclosure statement: I'm not trying to pick on VW. They are fine products and I've even owned a bunch, Beetles, a Golf, a Passat and still have a Westy. But, based on my experience, let's just say I like my Honda just fine, thanks).
4 year(s) ago via
Ross Dean, I see what you are saying, but your figures are off The complexity and price of the small ecoboost engines rivals that of a small diesel engine! There is certainly not a $4k price differential. This morning I see a story that Ford is planning to include cooled EGR on its small ecoboost engines for additional economy improvements - I.E. the exact kind of systems that make the diesel engines more expensive in the first place. The 2.0L TDI is a 1900 dollar option on a VW, but that price also includes more features on the car! In reality you make your money back on the engine choice in just a few years.
4 year(s) ago via
Ross Darren.... have to disagree with you there. You can't even smell the exhaust from a new audi/vw diesel. I just huffed from a Q7 TDI tailpipe the other day and could barely tell there was an engine running, it's pretty remarkable. Furthermore the 2.0L TDI does not need urea injection - no blue fluid. You simply service it the way you would any other turbocharged engine. Oh yeah, but with 10k mile oil changes. The big fancy SUV diesels are truly expensive, yes, but the practical small cars with small diesels are very simple and affordable.
4 year(s) ago via
Jeep CRD This is in the "duh" category. I'm not sold on hydrid (batteries, complexity). Look at the success the Europeans have here with their diesels (VW/Audi/BMW/MB). It's about to hit more mainstream with Mazda deciding that diesels make more sense than hybrids. My wife's 05 Mazda MPV will get traded in as soon as someone has a people hauler (e.g. C-Max) with a small diesel (< 3.0L) in it.
4 year(s) ago via
Fred Kuechenmeister EcoBoost is all well and good, yes it provides more power and better mileage. BUT.. It also adds complexity to the engine, which may bring up reliabilty questions in the future. A simpler engine is a better engine, with fewer things to go wrong it can lead to faster diagnostics and quicker repair, even if most cars on the market now come with some sort of computer control and diagnostic system. A diesel engine is attractive because just about any hominid with an instruction manual and wrench can work on it, or you can take it to just about any diesel mechanic to have it worked on. You also get massive amounts of torque in the low end which is where a majority of american drivers spend their drive time. A gasoline engine cannot match to torque qualities of a diesel. With a little tweaking the diesels in the Volkswagen A.G. cars could easily produce 500 ft/lb or more, you'd need to drop a V-8 to get that kind of power out of a gas engine.
4 year(s) ago via
Darren M Diesels stink, even the new 'clean' ones. They are shockingly expensive to service, especially the new 'clean' one (look up the price of 'blue' fluid, you'll see). And the economics aren't there in North America absent the policy & taxation frameworks used in Europe. Bottom line, Ford: don't bother with diesels.
4 year(s) ago via
JThomas Absolutely, I would even like to see the Ford Ranger with a Diesel.
4 year(s) ago via
Jake Reimer Yeah I wish more mainstream automakers would follow this ideology besides VW. There are plenty of people who live in the countryside or who just have a high milage do to work that cannot benefit from hybrids, but would benefit hugely from a diesel powertrain. Although a diesel hybrid would be the best way to go.
4 year(s) ago via
Dean Hammond heres a counter to all the bonefide diesel lovers....say I could bring something that basically performs the same as a diesel, at a savings of $3 -4000 ( approx is within 3-4 mpgs ) runs on cheaper fuel , and is cheaper to maintain. And I could deliver this to you within 1-2 years? Sound good?.....its coming, small eco-boost engines with flat diesel like torque curves, relatively similar mileage, easier ( read CHEAPER ) maintenence...and more readily available cheaper fuel. Diesel engines come with a PREMIUM...and if one divides that 3-4k premium @ say $3 a gallon...thats 1000 - 1300 gallons.....thats a LOT of mileage if one attains 35-40mpgs.....diesels ONLY superiority is in truck configurations ( perhaps as eco hasnt crossed that line yet, but IT too is coming ) when under load mileage suffers less. So I say YES to Fords 4.4 diesel in Expeditions, F-150's and lt duty Superduties, but eco may change some peoples minds in other applications....ie in 1.6, 2.0 and 1.2 liter configurations.
4 year(s) ago via
Paul Rufledt I agree, diesel is highly appealing to people who are interested in performance, as it offers higher fuel economy but without all of the added weight and complexity of a hybrid powertrain. They are also easily tunable, and Audi has shown a diesel's ability to win in motorsports.
4 year(s) ago via
GeoB I agree, we need more diesels! I travel in Europe and have many European friends. If I could have gotten a Volvo SUV with a diesel like my european friends I would have bought one, but they only sold gas guzzlers in the U.S. Next month I'm renting a diesel Ford Mondeo in Italy and would love to have something like that available here.
4 year(s) ago via
Mike Had a 2001 TDI Jetta. Loved the engine, hated the awful quality from VW. Ford has good diesel engines in Europe and I have been complaining for about 10 years to at least offer them over here. Who cares if they can't sell them in California because of emission requirements?
4 year(s) ago via
Jeremy O I have been looking for anything diesel that is not a huge truck and not German. If they had any diesel F150 or smaller I would buy one, especially in the flex or Edge. I really hope that they listen and quit with the expensive heavy hybrids.
4 year(s) ago via
Beau Snyder I would love it if Ford would bring efficient diesels to the US. I would definitely consider a Ford if it carried that type of an engine. One of the most important things I look for in a car is a balance between gas mileage and power, and diesels offer the best of both worlds in my opinion.
4 year(s) ago via
Rob Agreed, diesel Edge or maybe that new Bronco Raptor and give me a diesel F-150. We would be green and loving the hills here in Austin TX
4 year(s) ago via
Irloyal Danks Small turbo-diesels in the Ford Edge, or Escape would be an excellent idea. The southwest US is a great market for a vehicle like this. Plenty of Torque (to tame hills and mountains) with excellent fuel efficiency. Build them and they will sell......
4 year(s) ago via
Mills R I love it. My first post was a request for US diesel options. Then I looked at the most popular posts and I see fully half of them are making a similar request. Ford has always has an incredible portfolio of cars it sold overseas that we never saw in the U.S. They claim to be building "world cars" now. Let's see if they really mean it.
4 year(s) ago via
MattM I second the idea of bringing over the diesel engines.
4 year(s) ago via
Bill If/when biodiesel can become mainstream (not as easy as it sounds), I agree. Until then, we're just driving up the price of diesel. Our infrastructure depends on diesel. Driving up those costs will drive up the price of all goods and services.
4 year(s) ago via
irloyal Small Turbo diesels for something like the Edge or Explorer Please. THese are perfect for the desert SW where cold weather is never really an issue, and the extra torque is a plus for hilly/mountainous travel
4 year(s) ago via
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